Don’t Make a Scene

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In this episode of YR’s Adult ISH podcast, co-hosts Nyge Turner and Dominique “Dom” French have a heart-to-heart with “Inherited” host shaylyn martos about losing your cool in public. Plus, they answer questions from young listeners about handling embarrassing moments.

Adult ISH is produced by YR Media. Be sure to follow all our socials @YRAdultISH!

Our podcast is distributed by Radiotopia from PRX. Please show your support for Adult ISH during our fall fundraiser by making a donation at: https://on.prx.org/Adultish. THANK YOU!

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Episode Transcript

Nyge: Welcome to Adult ISH, produced by YR Media and brought to you by Radiotopia from PRX. I’m Nyge Turner.

Dom: And I’m Dominique French. And today’s episode is a great one to listen to while you’re crying in the back of the Uber, fighting with your mom in the mall, or having a friend break up in a coffee shop in Brooklyn because today we’re talking about public displays of emotion.

Nyge: That sounds like a little bit of personal experience.

Dom: (laughs)

Nyge: So which one of those happened to you?

Dom: More like which one of those didn’t happen. I stay crying in the back of the Uber.

Nyge: Ooh, that’s tough.

Dom: It sure is. But today, not only are we talking tearful rideshares and arguments with audiences, we’re doing so with our good friend and colleague. Joining us is associate producer and real life human being with feelings, Shaylyn Martos.

shaylyn: Hi, folks. I have feelings.

Dom: So first things first; I want to get an idea of how likely y’all are to display your emotions publicly. So, on a scale from one or as I like to call it, “we’ll talk about this at home” to five or yelling, “you always do this!” at your significant other in the club. How would you rate yourself?

shaylyn: Oh, I would say a solid, like 3.5-4.

Dom: Oh, that’s so that’s so weighty and meaty. I love it.

Nyge: Yeah, that’s probably healthy. Um, I would say I’m a one for sure. (Dom: Conservative!) I think that’s definitely changed over time. Like I’ve, when I was younger I used to like, really wear my emotions like, on my sleeve. But I think, like, as I’ve gotten older, like, I’m definitely like “talking about this with you later”.

Dom: Mhm.

Dom: That’s so. Austere of you.

Dom: I feel like I’m a four, and the only reason I’m a four is because I don’t have a significant other to yell at at the club.

shaylyn: Now I’m thinking I was, I used to be a five. There all the time, ready to throw down. But like Nyge, what you’re saying with time, I’ve kind of tempered. Yeah, like, all right, I’m going to pick my battles a little bit better.

Dom: That’s so beautiful, I’ve done the exact opposite. I’ve learned to express my emotions and the time and place in which I do that has, that hasn’t quite matured with my ability to express my emotions.

Dom: I was literally crying in a back of an Uber one time and I was doing it so hard that I thought the person, they reached to some tissues that they had in the passenger seat and I thought they were going to offer me one, but instead they blew their nose. It was wild.

Dom: So what was the last time you lost your cool in a crowd?

Nyge: Oh, my God.

Dom: And I can go first because I have so many.

shaylyn: Yeah, yeah, yeah, Go ahead. Go ahead. I’ll think about it.

Dom: Literally cried on a second date. It was so embarrassing.

Nyge: That’s not, like wild for me, though. Like, I don’t know, crying is different. Like, I don’t know, I could cry when I just need to.

Dom: I’m gonna agree to disagree.

shaylyn: I need, now I need to hear this.

Dom: This first date was amazing. It was and I’m a pretty good first dater. I turn in a good first date, I do a good showing. But so, the second date comes around. I’m super excited, that person’s super excited. And we like show up, we kiss and it’s like immediately kind of off. We had so much fun the first time, conversation was so flowing. We just made you laugh so much and the second time there are just so many nerves. And I went ahead and told them that on a second date, I’m much more nervous than I am on a first date because you’ve got stuff to lose.

shaylyn: You gotta keep it up. 

Nyge: Yeah.

Dom: Stakes! Yeah. But we finally got our seats at a restaurant and this dude says something that’s along the lines of a pretty clear rejection. He was like, “You know, I’m not sure if it’s you or if it’s me, but I just don’t know if I’m feeling this super romantically,” which bear in mind, I’ve heard many times. It wasn’t my first go around, but like we were like at a restaurant and I was like, “Then why am I here?” And I said that out loud. And he was like, “Great question,” 

Nyge: “Great question,” jeez…

Dom: And kept talking and I was like, It was like there was an echo in mind of “Why am I here? Why am I here? Why am I here? Why am I here? Why are they here?” And I just like, I was like, oh, no, I feel myself starting to cry. And because I was aware of it, I- it just made it worse. And I was like, it would be so bad if I cried right now. And then I did. And he was like, “I notice that you’re upset. Do you want to talk about it?” And I was like, “No!” And then I left.

Nyge: Yo, he just put up a fight? Like… 

(laughter)

Dom: I don’t- I don’t know!

Nyge: “I notice that you’re upset, do want to talk about it?” Like, it sounds like a reunion episode.

Dom: It was Real Housewives of Atlanta.

Nyge: Like, Love is Blind Reunion.

Dom: It was so awful. And then that thing happened of me crying in the uber with the tissue. It was a real one-two punch.

shaylyn: Oh, that was the same night.

Dom: Same day, same afternoon. So people could really see my tears glistening in the sun.

shaylyn: Oh, my love.

Dom: I know, I know.

shaylyn: I think. Okay. I think I’ll go next. I have this one, and I’m a little bit nervous about it. But I have this partner, fantastic partner but we can be, like a silo or something, like kind of like we can get each other into a whirlpool. Or if I start feeling really anxious and I start kind of like acting out and then he’ll start doing it, and then it’s just like a what’s the word I’m looking for? Like a whole cycle. 

Dom: A vicious cycle?

shaylyn: Yeah, kind of. Kind of like a cycle. So. So I was upset. We were hanging out with these people who were really mean to me. For whatever reason. They have their reasons. Whatever. I’m all about conflict. Let’s talk about it, come to me face to face, I don’t care if I cry in front of you. We’re going to talk about it, we’re going to work through it. And if us working through it means that we never talk again. Well, then that’s good. One less person that I have to think about. 

Nyge: I’d say like the last time I had like a big, like, I don’t know I guess I only like really have expressed like anger in public. Like I’m not like a crier in public. Not because, like, I don’t want to just because, like, I can’t. It just doesn’t happen. And like, everybody would be, like, crying around me, and it’ll be like a moment where I’d be like, “Yo, I’d be a really good look if you cried right now”.

Dom: It’d be really good for the brand if you shed a tear right now.

Nyge: It’s like, “Yo, it’s like getting pretty awkward that I’m not crying in this moment, like people are looking at me.” Like you ain’t crying? But the last time I had a real, like, blow up, I guess was, um at this party. I’m also nervous about this, but I mean, this person and I are cool now, so it should be good. But at this party, this person I pulled up and I knew them and like they pulled up outside and like I came out there and like I said, “what’s up?” Like, dap them up or whatever. And then, like, it was cool. It was like it was all good. I was like, walk him back into the party and I guess like they thought, like I came out there kind of like checking them or something like that when I wasn’t like the energy, like I was on like at all. And I heard them, like, whisper under their breath like, “Yeah, it better be good” or something like that, right. And then like, as I was walking back up and then it just kind of popped off from there and, and I really lost my cool. And it was, it was just not good. It was not good. But I, you know, I later talked to this person. We like we called each other, we chatted, we linked in person and we’re on good terms now.

shaylyn: That’s great-

Dom: May I ask- Shaylyn and I had very different reactions to that, Shaylyn’s like “Like, that’s so nice that you came to that.” And I’m like, “May I ask what happened”

(all laugh)

Dom: Did it come to fisticuffs?

Nyge: Nah.

Nyge:I mean, no, no. Like, nobody laid hands on each other. It was good. It was enough people there where it was like it was broken up. Like, there’s a lot of yelling, a lot of yelling, you know. A lot of yelling and a lot of, like, holding people back. A lot of, you know, shirt ripping, like, you know, people just holding people back. Like it was like a it’s like a basketball fight, you know? You know, like you watching the NBA and like, they get into like they get into it at the NBA and there’s a whole bunch of like, “If they wasn’t holding me back right now!”

shaylyn: “Hold me back, man! Hold me back!”

Nyge: It was a bunch of that. A lot of fake reaches over people. It was a lot of that going on but like it wasn’t…

Dom: Arms get real short all of a sudden. 

Nyge: Yeah right. It was not a it was not a it was not a fight at all.

shaylyn: Well, I think that’s so funny. Nice because like, like your like big public displays have mostly been anger. That’s something that I feel very uncomfortable expressing in public now. It’s like it is totally people will look at folks like myself and Dom crying on a bus and be like, “Oh yeah. And that’s just like, that’s just them. They’re just, you know, doing whatever.” But if, like, I try to like, go after someone, if I feel like, “okay, I’m going to yell at them, hold me back, man, hold me back,” it’s going to go really, really badly. So or at least that’s what’s programmed in me to think. And that’s why I always try to tell people, okay, let’s talk this out one on one so that I don’t blow up at you. But I run all of these beautiful little scenarios in my head, like, what would I say? Like, how would I really cut them? And then sometimes I’ll be looking at someone and I’ll be just running through these scenarios in my head and I’ll just start crying.

Dom: Oh.

Nyge: Yeah, I did a lot of that.

Dom: I’ve made myself angry. I made myself very mad at someone for like a fake alternate universe argument version.

Nyge: I’m mad over a response to a response that I had to a response that they originally had. That’s all in my brain. Like, we have five steps ahead of this conversation and I’m mad about where this could have gone five steps ahead. Had you said this, had you said that and had you did this? Like, Yeah, I hate that. I’m I don’t know. I’m not like a angry person. I’m like, I don’t like to think of myself that way, at least. And so, like, when it happens, like it’s always like, “oh, why is this going on?”

(music)

Dom: So Nyge, you sort of talked about your like one of your big sort of displays of emotion that leads me into talking about what is one of the worst times that emotions have spilled over. I can go first. Okay, so, speaking of having your friend breakup in a coffee shop in Brooklyn. Me and my friend, let’s call her Kay. We were like very fast friends. And it got to the point where we were like, we’re some of the closest two people that two people can be, and we’re going to live together in New York after I graduate college. Like, we’re thick as thieves and. But there’s no honor among thieves.

Nyge: Oh, my God.

Dom: So they meet a boy and they’re like, “I’m in love.”

shaylyn: Mm hmm.

Dom: You’ve been kicked to the curb. We’re going to live together and you’re not invited. 

shaylyn: Oh!

Dom: And this is my like, after graduation. This is like, the one thing I have to kind of hold on to is like, I have something figured out. Yeah. So this is, like, a big deal for me and it kind of wrecks our relationship a bit. Cut to us being like, “Hey, do you want to try and talk things out?” after not speaking for like months and months and months. So we’re in this coffee shop, we’re talking about like the “she said, she said” of it all and I lose it. I’m not really a yeller, outside of just being a loud person organically while being happy. But I yell at her like, yelling, crying. In an open concept coffee bar.

shaylyn: Love it.

Dom: People are looking at us and I’m like, having like a meta moment where I’m like rising outside of my body, looking at us from a third party perspective, I’m like, “They think that one of us is dying. They think one of us is dying and it’s causing like a romantic breakup.” I have never in my life behaved this way, and I had never been in a position where I just felt so hurt and misunderstood by someone that I trusted so much. And it all came to a head in such a public forum with people so, so close to us. And lasted for so long. We yelled at each other for so long, I’m like shocked that someone didn’t come over to us and be like, “Hey, I work for management. Is everything okay over here?”

Nyge: It was probably a lot of people watching. They were probably invested.

shaylyn: 100%. As a former service worker, I would have let y’all do your thing.

Dom: Yeah. Popcorn?

Nyge: Yeah.

Dom: But we got through it, and at the end, it was like kind of hugs and, like, “do you want to rekindle this friendship?” And sort of ending on a “I don’t know, like, let me take my time and process the onslaught of emotions” and it was just kind of never the same again. But I think there was something so cathartic about getting to do the things that you think like, say, all the arguments, all the comebacks, all the things that you’ve been thinking about in the shower lately.

Nyge: Yeah.

Dom: Out loud at that person in real time. And honestly, I’m not even embarrassed.

shaylyn: You shouldn’t be.

Dom: Good, cause I’m not.

shaylyn: Yeah, you shouldn’t be.

shaylyn: It does remind me when I was working at this sushi bar. But there were tables kind of tucked in the corner. And there was always someone like there was always a couple breaking up in that corner and I don’t know why. Probably because we were across the street from the community college that I went to but like, I legit would have to go over there and be like, “water?” And then like one of them is crying, the other one is just sitting like, really stoically “I don’t have any feelings”. I mean, I would stand there and feel a little jealous because I haven’t like, I haven’t been able to do what you did Dom, like sit across from someone and legit yell at them and be like “you know what, bah bah bah bah!” right? So if I was in front of someone like that I’d have my little piece of paper with my notes with what I wanted to say to them and I would probably be like, “mhm, oh ok I understand that, uhm” and like I’m trying to break myself out of that.

Nyge: Growing up, I was like a black man like my parents would always talk to me about that. Like, I don’t, you don’t show anger in front of people like that. Like especially if you’re in like a setting, like you’re in public. Like two people like, arguing or whatever it could just turn out a certain way. And so, I always try to like think that I always kind of have that in my mind, where as like, “all right I can’t get too loud, I can’t do too much or whatever” because I just don’t want to put myself in like the wrong situation, right? But then on top of that, it’s like. I still also have these feelings and I want to express them and I want to get my point across. And I have like a lot of like thoughts and things like that and if I don’t like, then we won’t be able to get to a better place or I’m going to just forever, like replay this conversation over and over and over again in my head. And that’s also something I don’t want to do, so it’s like weighing those things is like that’s like the constant battle with this.

Dom: And that brings me to my last question, which is, if you could go back to those moments, what would you say to yourself or any other party involved?

shaylyn: Oh, I know. Okay, So in that thing that I brought up, I would just, like, get up and go to directly to the person that was like kind of. Well, that I had the most conflict with and just like, yell at her. Straight up. Like I would, I would change that and because I don’t think it would have affected the outcome. But I would have felt better about it.

Dom: Yeah.

shaylyn: Yeah.

Dom: I would have been crying in the back of that Uber and I’d be like, “Can I have a tissue?”

Nyge: Give me a tissue.

Dom: You monster.

Nyge: Do you not see me crying?

shaylyn: Wow, yeah that driver really did that to be like “mhm Don’t you wish you would? Don’t you wish you could have a tissue? Oh, look at me.”

Nyge: Um, I don’t know. I have no idea what I would do, I feel like each scenario is just like there’s pros and cons behind both different types of like, reactions because I have avoided, like, conflict a lot, and it doesn’t make me feel good ever. And even when I try to like, tell myself like “okay, like you made the right move, like that was, that was the method” but then I’m just thinking about it like I think about it for like years down the line where I’m like, “I can’t believe this person did that. Like, I’m like, Yeah, if this happened again, I’m going to react differently” yadda yadda. So it’s like, I don’t know I guess you have to just really make a decision almost before you get into situations like that. Like you just have to kind of like know yourself, know what you’re willing to like give your time and your energy to or whatever before you get into those situations. So like, if you’re someone who’s like, “I don’t want to like argue in public, that’s not something that ever makes me feel good after. Like, that’s something I really want to change about myself.” It just doesn’t benefit my life.” Then I think that’s a decision that you make and then when those situations arise, like that’s the choice that you choose. But if you’re someone who’s like, you know, “I need to voice how I’m feeling, um, in order to be able to sleep at night” then you got to do what’s best for you. Um, and so I’d say I would, I would probably react the same way that I reacted. Somebody said something about me, you know, they like provoked me or whatever. Like, I’m not, I’m not like ashamed that I said something about it, but I guess I would, I would take back the fake fighting part of it.

shaylyn: I was just imagining…

Nyge: It was, it was a mess.

shaylyn: I think, like, I’m just trying to teach myself as time goes on that it’s okay to be messy.

Nyge: Mhm.

shaylyn: As long as you’re not doing harm.

Dom: Mhm.

Nyge: Yeah.

shaylyn: So if I want to not have a good relationship with a certain group of people because I don’t want that or I don’t want them or whatever or what have you, it’s okay. No, not everybody has to be my friend and I don’t have to be friends with all of my friend’s friends, right? I’m not going out and trying to slander anybody or hurt anybody. And it’s okay that I’m not everybody’s cup of tea.

Nyge: If you want to hear more from Shaylyn, you can check out season three of Inherited. 

(music) 

Nyge: Getting emotional in public can definitely feel embarrassing, which can lead to replaying those awkward social interactions over and over again in your mind. That’s right, it’s not just you, it’s us. To prove it, we had our young folks at YR submit questions on that exact topic. And here’s question one with our intern.

Dom: Oh, I think that begs the question, what did you do? But that’s a big one. That’s especially when you’re getting started in your career. That can be so stressful.

Nyge: I know first impressions in general are, like, really nerve wracking, right? Like anytime you meet somebody, it’s like, “okay, we have no previous conversations. I can’t be like hey, how’s ma?” you know what I mean? Like, I can’t like, we have no rapport. Like, we have to develop all of that on the spot.

Dom: They’re like, “she left, great.”

Nyge: These are our appetizers huh. But it’s just like, I don’t know, those first impressions are always like, really nerve wracking especially for me. And so I say, like, just be yourself, you know like, I immediately just lead in with things that I’m into. I talk about movies, I talk about music, I talk about TV shows because the things that like, I’m genuinely interested in. And so when I can like, ask people genuine questions, like I don’t, I won’t be like performing you know? And I think that’s what I like most about, like doing what I when I first meet people. People want it to feel authentic, they want it to feel organic. And so I ask a question that I actually genuinely care about. And I think if you do that, then you’ll spark off an adult conversation and form a connection with that person. Next question is how do I approach situations when people get mad at me in public? Dom.

Dom: Pointed but true. But no, this is something I feel like, this is something I struggle with because you know people, there’s like a meme of like, insecure girlfriends being like, “are you mad at me?” That’s me to everyone I know all the time. So I think one tap into whether or not you’re a “Let’s talk about this at home” kind of person or like in a private space or if it’s something that you’re like, “hey, let’s address this in the moment.” That’s something that works for both of you. And I think just, if they say that they’re not, You kind of just have to take their word for it and roll with it. But as a person with an anxious attachment style, I know that that can be very hard. But if they are mad, talk it through. See if you offended them, see if you hurt their feelings in some way, and be open to giving an earnest and sincere apology. Even if that’s not what you intended to do because most of the time when you hurt someone’s feelings, it’s not what you meant to do.

Nyge: Mmhmm. Yeah, I agree. Um, no, no, it’s. No, that’s.

Nyge: Yeah I’ve, you answered perfectly. Anything I would say would be repeating exactly what you said. Next question is, What do you do when you think someone is waving at you in public and they actually aren’t? This is a really good one.

Nyge: I really like this, I like this question. I’ll start off, um.

Nyge: That has happened to me often. Um, and you know, I just like because usually, like, I’ll kind of like smile and like, do some type of motion back and then just whatever motion that is, like you could kind of like try to turn into like a little dance move or you could just like, you could like scratch your head or something like that, or if there’s like something like above you or whatever, like, say you’re like on Bart or something like that and there’s like some like, handle like, you just grab the hand, go for it. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, just something there to like, just kind of smooth out like the motion and then it, you probably threw a smile on your face, too, when that happened.

Dom: You’re like, waving but you’re so mad.

Nyge: You could just, you could just keep on smiling and really, like just keep the smile going. There’s nothing wrong with smiling and probably don’t continue to look at the person when you realize it’s not, they weren’t waving at you. Um and I mean, that’s when in doubt, like you always got your cell phone on you. So you have that cell phone out, you just get to text and act like somebody just hit you or something like that. And act busy on it and I think, I think you’ll be alright.

Dom: I have two answers. The first is lean in. Wave at them harder. Wave until they come over to you. Maybe get to know them, maybe exchange phone numbers, maybe you go out to dinner, maybe you follow. Or if you want to play it cool, you make them think that they think they thought you were waving to them, but you’re not. So you waved to them and then when they’re like, “I’m not waving to you” be like, “I’m not waving to you. I’m just waving to someone behind you.” Someone much cooler behind this idiot.

Dom: Those are my solutions here.

Nyge: I think, I think that’s more of the fall in love like scenario, because it’s like then you point to someone behind them, and then you walk up to the person behind them and you’re like, “Hey”, like you explain what happened. You just got caught in the old waves switcheroo.

Nyge: You just got a cardinal wave.

Dom: Maybe get some coffee.

Nyge: I’m now trying to have.

Dom: You yell at them at the coffee shop.

Nyge: Till we have a fake conversation for two seconds that I could just play off this awkward thing. Yeah you know like, the fake conversation sparks off yall like each other, you go on a date.

Dom: Yo, did we just write a romcom?

Nyge: I think.

Nyge: I think that could be a move. But yeah, I don’t know, it happens to all of us though.

Dom: Happens to all of us.

(music)

Dom: Thank you so much to everyone who submitted questions for this portion of our episode. And with that, my final notes are: If you gotta be mad at someone, be mad at someone. You know, I think Shaylyn said it best when they said, you know, I don’t have to be everyone’s cup of tea. I don’t have to be friends with everyone. And that’s one less person I got to think about. I was like, “Now that’s a Real Housewives of Atlanta.” Like the introduction thing like, “that’s one less person I have to think about.” I love that. And that’s like a hard thing to really get like deep down in your heart because I think on a fundamental level, we all want to be liked widely, you know, by a lot of people. Maybe that’s just me. Maybe I’m.

Nyge: Talking like you talk and talk.

Dom: Okay. Okay.

Dom: But that’s just not how it works. And like, don’t throw good after bad if your emotions aren’t safe to be with another person, either publicly or privately, wherever, then really reconsider whether or not you and that person have a future in each other’s lives.

Nyge: Yeah.

Dom: What about you? What did this episode bring up for you?

Nyge: Yeah, I really like that. I mean, you know, you don’t like everybody, right? So like, why do you want everybody to like you? You know, and so, I mean when you really think about it, it’s nothing like personal, even like the things that the people that you don’t like I mean, there’s probably some people you like genuinely don’t like for good reasons, but some people, it’s just like, I mean, like, it’s nothing personal. It’s just like we’re just two different people and it’s nothing wrong with that. There will still be people out there who genuinely love you and rock with you, and you are exactly their cup of tea. So like, don’t worry about one person’s feelings or whatever of you. And yeah, feel your feelings like, like Shaylyn said, like it’s, it’s not something that you should just, like, go around, like, hiding, like make sure one like that, you know, you’re safe and that it doesn’t bring you harm and but still do what’s best for you. Express yourself, you’ll feel much better in the long run and you’ll be able to sleep a lot easier because you said all the things you know, they know.

Dom: Absolutely. And you know what bud? You’re my cup of tea, you’re my friend, and I like you.

Nyge: You’re my friend and I like you as well. I don’t like tea tho. Nah, I’m playing I like tea. I think. 

(music) 

Nyge: Adult ISH is produced by YR Media, a national network of young artists and journalists, creating content for this generation. Our show is produced by Shayla Martos, Dominique French and by me. Your boy, Nyge Turner.

Dom: Our engineer as James Riley and our audio engineering fellow is Christian Romeo.

Nyge: YR’s director of podcasting is Sam Choo.

Dom: YR’s senior director of podcasting and partnerships is Rebecca Martin.

Nyge: Our interns are Menelik Ransom and Jalen Black.

Dom: Original music for this episode created by these young musicians at YR: Christian Rameau, Anders Knutstad, Noah Holt, Jacob Armenta, Chaz Whitley, Michael Diaz, Sean Luciano Galarza and David Lawrence. Music Direction by Oliver “Kuya” Rodriguez and Maya Drexler.

Nyge: Art for this episode was produced by the Youth Co-led Team at YR Media. Creative Direction by Pedro Vega Jr. Designed by Marjorie Masa Kat and Brigido Bautista.

Dom: Project management by Eli Arterton.

Nyge: Special thanks to Jasmine Barton, Siobhan Graham, Danielle Connelly and Cara Kyle’s.

Dom: Adult ISH is a proud member of Radiotopia from PRX, a network of independent creator owned, listeners supported podcasts. Discover audio with vision at Radiotopia.fm.

Nyge: And if you haven’t reviewed our show on Apple podcasts, please be sure you do. Five stars is much appreciated.

Dom: You can follow us on all the socials @yradultish. And on that note, you always do this.

Nyge: Oh, my. See you later.

Dom: If anyone heard that and thought, “Man, I really wish you’d yell at me at the club” you know? Reach out.

(laughter)